Talk:Team Building

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Galbias (talkcontribs)

I feel like the list of Primal weapons is getting crowded and there are still some weapons that need to be added. Anyone else think it'd look better with the weapon list split, probably between gacha weapons and farmable?

Zeze (talkcontribs)

I think making two-column tables for farmable vs. gacha (would probably use the term "Premium Draw" on the actual page) would be a good idea.

It's also about time we rearranged those lists into a more logical order anyways; right now, it's neither alphabetical nor by source (raid/Grand/regular draw/etc). I think a good way to organize it would be splitting it up by farmable vs. gacha, then by source (Grand Weapons vs. Regular Premium Draw / Raids), then alphabetical. Raids can be sorted by unlock order/difficulty seen on the in-game raid list.

Galbias (talkcontribs)

I haven't been able to get a table to look good, so I just used the existing formatting, if anyone else has better luck feel free to update it.

Also added a couple of other updates, I ordered Grand weapons roughly by release order.

Article Overhaul?

Zeze (talkcontribs)

Looking through this article, I feel like there's a lot of overlap with Basic Grids, as it really only talks about grids despite mentioning characters and summons in the intro paragraph. The article gets a bit more into later-game builds, but it seems a bit odd to have two articles covering grids and none about party optimization (which I had assumed a page titled Team Building would be about). Most players new to the game would probably appreciate a guide on party-building, especially those who don't luck into many SSRs and/or assume that SSRs are strictly better than SRs.

To this end, some proposals I have:

  • Team Staples (maybe rename section to Overview?): Add subheaders for Grids, Characters, and Summons
    • Grid section can contain info on general-purpose weapons like Bahamut, Atma/Ultima, and Seraphic. I don't think people really use Cosmos weapons nowadays, but it wouldn't hurt to include them. Probably include weapons that should not be on grids and/or replaced ASAP, like regular gacha weapons.
    • Characters section: Highlight things you want on the team, like Def Down cap and DATA. It's a bit difficult to go into full depth for obvious reasons, but noting what makes certain party compositions better (and thus, point to how characters get ranked on tier lists) may be helpful. A list of good filler characters from early-unlock side stories might be helpful, though it may fall into the territory of being too subjective.
    • Summons section: Probably note that having strictly all same-element summons isn't necessary, since aura only takes effect for main summons (and sub-auras for sub-summons with them). Note usefulness of MLB SR Carbuncles as sub-summons.
  • Omega Grids: Not sure if we want to talk specific numbers like the Basic Grid page due to meta shifts, but if desired it may help to note where/how grid shifts take place. For example late-game Wind is 3 FLB Last Storm Harp and 3 Tia Guns, not a complete replacement. Most of the advice for Fire now is mostly AES, replacing Canes outside of very short fights, and Fire M2 is usually only one or two weapons if any.
  • I don't know enough about Normal or Grand Order teams to give much input on their sections.
    • Normal can probably also note the Demi-Primal summons from WMTSB2 side story, which is a semi-accessible way to enter Primal grid territory without lucksacking the right summons.
    • Grand Order: The meta has shifted far enough into rainbow that having a section for GO teams seems a bit misleading in a guide for new players. Most of the section advises either gacha characters (lucksack) or Eternals (not accessible to new players), and talks about using T4 classes (which are HL-only, by which point you really want single-element teams). Personally, we could remove the entire section or comment it out until some meta-changing update happens that suddenly makes these teams more viable.

Lastly, some standardization of colloquial terms.

  • We've used the term "support summons" somewhat interchangeably here and on the Basic Grid page. In-game, support summon specifically means the friend summon we bring into the fight, while sub-summon is used for the 4 additional summons in our team. In the article, we used support summon to refer to sub-summons at the top of the page, which may be cause of some confusion later when we talk about support summons proper.
  • Similarly, with the grid, we call it "support weapons" here and "sub weapons" in the Weapon Skills page. I think we should use either "grid weapons" or "sub weapons"; the latter is the official term in the in-game Help section, but "grid" such a common term used among players that using "9 grid weapons" in the intro paragraph should get the point across just fine. Whichever we choose, we can later replace the term "Main Support Weapons" with either "Grid Weapons" or "Sub Weapons" for consistency.

Mar. 16 Update: I've went ahead and made updates for the Team Staples/Overview section as I had earlier suggested. Feel free to adjust what I've written if anything is incorrect/misleading. Also standardized the terms as per my last bullet for clarity.

AdlaiT (talkcontribs)

I only skimmed through your page edit, but it looks good. Go ahead and continue. Outside of ensuring that proper game terminology and wiki syntax are used, I prefer not to contribute to these kinds of pages myself and let more knowledgeable people handle it.

--AdlaiT (talk) - Wiki Admin 19:10, 16 March 2019 (UTC)

KonatsuSV (talkcontribs)

I agree the much of what this article cover is either outdated or misleading, especially in the grids part probably due to the meta changing a lot since the last time someone maintained this page.

As for the GO section, I believe that removal is probably necessary, specifically because I don't think that anyone is proficient enough at building a GO team to give good advice on it. If anyone does make it work (somewhat) then maybe it is okay.

KonatsuSV (talkcontribs)

I updated most of the Omega portions to my best knowledge. In my opinion most of what was written are commonly agreed upon, except a few niche/experimental options that are still being tested out. If there's any glaring issues or things you disagree with please let me know.

I would not be updating any Primal section apart from Hades since I don't play them. But from my experience they definitely need some work. If anyone is interested and have relevant experience please help update those sections.

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